Interview with

Founder & Teacher, Desiring God

Audio Transcript

Welcome back to the podcast with longtime author and pastor John Piper. There’s an atheistic tendency in every heart — my heart and even in your heart, Pastor John. You said so when we looked at this “powerful atheistic tendency in every human heart” about a year ago in APJ 1980, a sobering episode. So, it’s no surprise that we frequently get emails from listeners struggling with doubt and unbelief — like James, a listener who writes us this: “Dear John, I remember listening to your biography of William Cowper some years ago. It has stayed with me all these years later. There’s something about his dark struggle that, in my own way, I can relate to.

“For about ten years now, it looks as though I’ve lost my faith. But I haven’t been successful in completely shutting out the nagging questions and doubts. The struggle appears to be in believing there’s a true narrative of how things are while also believing that there’s no way of little old me figuring that all out, especially when the best of the best within various academic disciplines disagree on these matters. I find myself in this agnostic no-man’s-land. It feels like an intellectually honest position, just not an overly satisfying one. The questions and doubts remain. So, I’m a little stuck on how to make any progress and would love to listen to any advice you might have for me.”

Perhaps God will use a few prayerful observations that I make from Scripture to awaken some new perspective that may help James get unstuck. That’s my prayer as we begin.

Root of Unbelief

James, you say, “For about ten years now, it looks as though I’ve lost my faith.” To this let me respond with 2 Peter 3:17. It says, “Take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability.” Now, here’s a warning to take care; that is, to guard against. Strikingly, the danger is lawlessness leading to deception, leading to loss of stability — that is, loss of faith. It goes back to lawlessness. What is that? A disposition of heart that chafes under authority and then comes up with authority-denying ideas that don’t fit reality. That is, they are deceptive.

James, you say that you struggle with believing that there’s a true narrative of how things are. That’s amazing. That is a classic manifestation of lawlessness — doubting that truth even exists. There is no true narrative. Nothing can be more lawless than carving out a place to live where there is no such thing as reality outside yourself that you have to deal with. You doubt, you say, that there is any true narrative of what is. In that world of lawlessness, the ego is totally untethered from reality. Peter calls this a great deception. And he says it’s the cause of losing our stability, our faith.

Indeed, what could be more unstable than a world where nothing is real? There’s no true narrative. So, consider, James, and be motivated to regain your stability.

How to Regain Your Stability

The writer to the Hebrews would say to you, “Here’s how you regain your stability in the fog of lawless deceptions.” He says this in Hebrews 12:3: “Consider him [Jesus] who endured from sinners such hostility against himself, so that you may not grow weary or fainthearted.” It is so easy and dangerous to become intellectually and spiritually weary, just exhausted at trying to consider hundreds of ideas that blow like leaves around our ears and make us feel disoriented and hopeless ever to regain any stability or faith at all. And Hebrews pleads with us: Consider Jesus. Consider the sufferings of Jesus. Consider the hostilities against Jesus. Rivet your attention on this. This is where you can find stability. Jesus authenticates himself through his sufferings.

Then, James, you add this to your doubt that any true narrative exists: you say, “There’s no way of little old me figuring all that out, especially when the best of the best within the various academic disciplines disagree on these matters.” To this I would say, “Be careful that in the name of humility — ‘little old me’ — you don’t find yourself actually mocking God.” The whole Bible is predicated on the decision of God, the Creator of the universe, to make himself known to ordinary people to such a degree that he holds them accountable to be willing to die for him.

So, if we say we’re just too little, too insignificant, too confused, too humble to understand or believe what God has revealed about the true narrative of what is, we have decided that either God made a bad decision to communicate, or he pulled it off very poorly. He has not done what he said he would do — namely, communicate himself and his salvation compellingly to ordinary people. That’s a very dangerous thing to say. It is an understatement when James describes his position as not an overly satisfying one. No, indeed. There is unwitting mockery of God built into it.

We Can See the Sun

If the sun is shining brightly at midday, and you see it, and there is a debate going on around you as to whether the sun is shining — and these are very smart people compared to little old you — will you surrender your eyes and your joy to the debaters? Would you give them that kind of power over you? To which James might say to me, “I’m not sure that’s a fair analogy, to say that I’m looking at the sun when I’m considering the truth of Christianity.” In communicating his truth to ordinary people, God does hold them accountable, not to become philosophers, but he holds them accountable to see the sun. And if they don’t see it, his explanation is that they’re blind, and the solution he offers is precisely a sight of the sun.

Here’s what he says in 2 Corinthians 4:4: “The god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.” I would dare anyone to claim that the light of the gospel of the glory of the Son of God is less compelling than the sun shining at midday. Then Paul adds, “God, who said, ‘Let light shine out of darkness,’ has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ” (2 Corinthians 4:6). How bright is that? Here’s what the apostle John says: “His face was like the sun shining in full strength” (Revelation 1:16).

James, God is pursuing you. You would not have written to me if he were not. So, as you seek him in fresh ways now, consider one last exhortation from the Lord Jesus in John 7:17: “If anyone’s will is to do God’s will, he will know whether the teaching is from God.” In other words, he will see the sun.